Usic/smp/cls

[2RUDE]

Read post #32 from Roadmap about the unions employing lazy a$$es with low IQ's (or something like that) then...

Now for the corrections...


Apparently the unions do not offer any classes in language arts or spelling and are happy to sign up those folks who most desperately need such classes.

"Art", to avoid such blunders in the future, notice the little ABC with the check mark in the upper left corner of the dialogue window.

GWJ_CAS,

Just curious as to whether or not you feel some sense of accomplishment, now that you've belittled "Locatingart" with your superior command of the English language? If you want to jump on a guy about making an off-topic post in this thread, that's one thing, but going after a guy, who is only trying to better his lot in life for himself and his fellow locators, in the manner which you did was absolutely uncalled for.

[GWJ_CAS]

GWJ_CAS,

Just curious as to whether or not you feel some sense of accomplishment, now that you've belittled "Locatingart" with your superior command of the English language? If you want to jump on a guy about making an off-topic post in this thread, that's one thing, but going after a guy, who is only trying to better his lot in life for himself and his fellow locators, in the manner which you did was absolutely uncalled for.

Perhaps it was over the top...I have a particular sore spot when it comes to folks who constantly preach the "Union" rhetoric. The lock step union mentality is counterintuitive and antiquated. I think unions prey on the weak-minded and under-educated by promising them a way to "level the playing field" and these folks buy this crap. My ill-conceived point in the correction post was to point out that "union folk" are not always the brightest stars in the sky and I apologize for my offense.

I think unions have far outlived their usefulness. I have a "union" background in my blood. My Grandfather (Mom's side) was an original founder of the Steamfitters Union in the early 1900's in Philly (Local 420 bears his mark). I have never been in a union, but I have always been in a field where no unions are necessary (I am a Civil Engineer) and for a great deal of my working life I have been in a management and owner position. I own a firm that does contract locating & SUE as part of our service offerings. Ask my locators if they want union representation, they will tell you NO, very loudly as the union folks make less and have fewer benefits and opportunities then they do.

I watched some of my high school buddies go into lines of work (in the late 70's & early 80's) where they felt it necessary to join the union for their trade. One was a fire sprinkler fitter, one was an electrician and two were jet engine mechanics. The fire sprinkler fitter worked five to six months a year, but bragged about making $17 per hour plus fringes while at the same time complaining about the "scab" companies that paid their guys $13 per hour (but those guys worked year-round and got decent benefits). Turns out the $13/hr guys grossed more pay every year than the $17/hr union guys...similar for my electrician buddy, 30 days of work here, 45 over there, never consistent, but bragging about his $18/hr for the four or five months of work...he finally saw the light when I hired him as a locator trainee at $12/hr and he admitted that he grossed more income at $12/hr working everyday then he did at $18/hr working sometimes...(he now makes over $22)

But by far the best union story belongs to my two close friends who are A&P Mechanics. Both worked for Eastern Airlines back in the day and both were making $19.60/hr plus benefits and flight privileges. They were some of the first guys to join the picket lines and go out on strike. The unions and the strike forced Eastern out of business. This was especially difficult for my family because my other Grandfather had worked for Eastern since 1937 when it was Eastern Mail Service. He flew with the great Eddie Rickenbacker up until WWII when he flew for the US Navy until 1946 and returned to Eastern to begin flying passengers. He worked there until 1979 having made it to VP of Base Operations Miami. My two buddies helped to crush a company that had been a part of my family's life for 45 years. The poetic justice is that they both had to take whatever jobs they could find in the A&P field and ended up working for a non-union shop as parts washers for $9.90/hr, almost $10/hr less than they were making at the company that they helped force out of business. They are both now auto mechanics for the State DOT Maintenance yard still making less today then they made at Eastern in 1983, and both still pay 3% to the AFSCME union because "they are union guys".

The idea that a union can dictate the fate of a company is unbelievable. Where is the sense of pride in the company you work for or the product you make? Every union guy I have ever spoken with shows no pride in his company or product and always spouts off about how he is being screwed by the company and how the company is getting fat off his labor and how they are going to strike if the company does not give them what they want.

One of my cousins works at the Ford Truck plant and is a UAW member. For the last seven years he has put the seats in F150 trucks. Nearly every workday for seven years. I asked him about doing a different a different job on the line just to switch things up...he said only when someone is out sick, he usually fills in for the steering rack guy, but that is his union "brother" Harold's job and "Harold would not try and take my job putting those seats in, so I won't try and get his job installing steering racks"...Lock Step Union Mentality, so out of touch and out of date.

[AULupstate]

I worked at a nuclear plant for a while when I had just left active duty. This following statement is ver batum what I was told when I attempted to pick up some trash that was on the floor to throw it away. "Don't do that. That is the maintenance peoples job. Call them and have them pick it up." This again follows the union mentality. Don't do anything other than what you were hired to do. No initiative, no clue about team work, no clue about 'real' life working conditions. Living in the union fantasy world makes you lazy, gives you a shitty 'I deserve it' attitude and makes you a shitty employee to hire for when your union cuts your job to save theirs.

[underground quester]

GWJ CAS

Very eloquently put message.

I too have a friend who is an airline mechanic and makes BIG BUCKS....when he works but that is not guaranteed year round. He keeps getting laid off, hired back, laid off, etc. but really keeps getting drawn back by the money.

He goes to work for other companies at about 25% less...and they WANT to keep him, but he just keeps going back to the union job. I guess in fairness, he has to in order to keep his seniority status.

But clearly as you pointed out so well, it can be a hare and tortoise kind of thing. Success does not always come to the one who runs the fastest or the furthest.

Good job of putting things in perspective.

[RoadMap]

.Lock Step Union Mentality, so out of touch and out of date.[/QUOTE]

Well said CAS. I have pro union relatives. Who believe union is the only way to go. But my dad was union was ran out after 31 years. Great union. CWA! What a crock! Here is your last check now get the F out.

[South Kansas]

(removed inappropriate and offensive personal attack)