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Thread: Phone peds

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    Default Phone peds

    Can someone please explain to me the easiest way to locate out of a copper phone ped. I have such a bad problem with bleed off especially on chainlink fences. But the area I am in the phone, cable and power seem to run right next to it. I have called my supervisor and my trainer several times but as of lately. All I'm tolled is that they are to busy and for me to figure it out... I have only been on my own for a week. While I was in training we spent more time doing stuff as fast as possible or in manhole and locating fiber which I'm not allowed to do. I feel like I have been set up to fail. But I'm not giving up. I have been working 10-12 hours a day trying to learn everything I can on my own. Just would like some tips on phone and maybe cable peds. Ppl tend to get mad when I unplug their cable lol but owell. I just want to do my best and help out in my area BC we are swamped right now as most of the country probly is.. Thanks I'm using an Rd 4000 with a 5 watt transmitter. I bounce between 8 and 33 when utilities r congested together
    Last edited by Lostunderground; April 13th, 2016 at 11:29 PM.

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    Default Re: Phone peds

    Comed and ATT are usually joint trenched and when I say joint trenched I mean right on top of each other . If you need help Message me .

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    Mke
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    Default Re: Phone peds

    Quote Originally Posted by Lostunderground View Post
    Can someone please explain to me the easiest way to locate out of a copper phone ped. I have such a bad problem with bleed off especially on chainlink fences. But the area I am in the phone, cable and power seem to run right next to it. I have called my supervisor and my trainer several times but as of lately. All I'm tolled is that they are to busy and for me to figure it out... I have only been on my own for a week. While I was in training we spent more time doing stuff as fast as possible or in manhole and locating fiber which I'm not allowed to do. I feel like I have been set up to fail. But I'm not giving up. I have been working 10-12 hours a day trying to learn everything I can on my own. Just would like some tips on phone and maybe cable peds. Ppl tend to get mad when I unplug their cable lol but owell. I just want to do my best and help out in my area BC we are swamped right now as most of the country probly is.. Thanks I'm using an Rd 4000 with a 5 watt transmitter. I bounce between 8 and 33 when utilities r congested together
    Rest assured that your anxiety will diminish the longer you spray paint. Unfortunately, the difficulty locating utilities within a foot of a chain link fence will not. There are some tricks you can do to help, but the right circumstances and tools need to be present. One of these tricks uses a piece of equipment that you don't have in the truck. This trick is my go to and helps out quite a bit when trying to locate a congested easement. I've only dabbled in the isolated ground theory. (please, anyone chime in to help un-muddle my explanation) Most of the time, in the real world of locating, this is used only in the real difficult, but desperately needed because of the type of excavation, locate requests. The theory is based on the want of the radio frequency applied to the line wants to naturally complete a circuit back to the transmitter. One of the reasons you have trouble with congested areas is because this return signal is running right next to your out going signal. An isolated ground wire between your ground clip and the far end of your target utility is supposed to help isolate the target utility (as long as you have distance between the ground laid return wire and your target utility).

    Before you try this out and get frustrated because it doesn't work as well as you hoped, understand that their is no "Golden Hook-up". There are many times where you hook up to a utility and the clouds will part, the beam of light will come down from the Heavens and you will faintly hear angels sing as the utility you are connected to lights up and you can run it for as long as you want. Then there are the times where the locate God doesn't call your # and everything you do does not give you the tone you want. This is where the true art of being a locator comes in.

    Most locates have to be treated like a mosaic. You have to piece the locate together from multiple hookups and multiple re-positioning of your transmitter and ground. This especially happens in congested areas. The only thing that will get you through these situations is your own mental checklist and the repetition of the previous locates, coupled with what makes sense.

    It sounds like your training was a bit fast pace. I don't know how well your trainer covered Un-bonding and Transmitter placement, but those two things are a must when it comes to locating congested areas. Let us know if you don't feel comfortable with those and we will try to help out. Also, if you have a specific situation, take some pictures and up-load them here. Visually seeing the layout for your locate will help us understand what will help you isolate the lines in question.

    mke

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    Default Re: Phone peds

    Mke's right. You'll never enjoy locating that close to a metal fence. Metal fence posts are the best grounds and pull your signal no matter what you do. I have unbonded/isolated the comm lines in the ped and actually used the fence itself as a ground. your signal will be pulled to the fence but as you're passing over the cable you can notice a jump in the signal. 810's were best for that because they had needles. Digital receivers are a little more subtle but it can work. There's no real solution though. You can take a little solace knowing that if they're not pulling the fence out and they're using machinery, they probably wont' get that close. Even so, call the contractor and warn him of the problems that close to chain link fences and I almost guarantee he will stay away from it. Contractors hate damages, even when they're not at fault.

    Forget 33 or higher in congested areas. 33 will jump from wire to wire in common easements let alone near metal structures like steel buildings and fences
    Last edited by daman1; April 14th, 2016 at 12:18 PM.

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    Mke
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    Default Re: Phone peds

    Quote Originally Posted by daman1 View Post
    ....Forget 33 or higher in congested areas.
    How Dare you sir!

    Most of my locates are done with the 810 @ 83.1... I will admit that it isn't for the faint of heart. However, I will take the Analog response of the 810 over the digital readouts on all other machines.
    Kramit69 likes this.

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    Default Re: Phone peds

    Quote Originally Posted by Mke View Post
    How Dare you sir!

    Most of my locates are done with the 810 @ 83.1... I will admit that it isn't for the faint of heart. However, I will take the Analog response of the 810 over the digital readouts on all other machines.
    Agree!! Analog is better Nothing digital comes close. My advice is for digital receivers only. I miss the old 810's. Don't leave your truck unlocked. I may just fly to Portland and filch it. Maybe I should drive. I suspect I'd never get it out of the airport without being chased and tackled by airport security and maintenance both.

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    Default Re: Phone peds

    use only 8.1 on the mains in those back yards and 33 when you are hunting drops . good luck . just keep on locating ...you will eventually teach yourself .
    wise men talk because they have something to say and fools because they have to say something....plato

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    Default Re: Phone peds

    Thanks for the responses I'm writing down notes right now. I think my trainer did the best he could considering we were almost 4 days behind and we were short staffed. So he was trying to catch up and train at the same time. I told my in class trainer I think I should get an extra week in the field training BC we have a city contract to. So I locate all the city utilities as well. Its all just a lil overwhelming at this point BC our area is swamped with locates now. So I try to do the best I can without spending an hour and a half on a cable drop. I'm still optimistic about locating since I have spent my whole life digging these lines up. And I'm loving the over time. Clocked out today with over 40 hrs and gonna work Sat to.. If u guys have any other advise u can give on any topic I would appreciate it.. Maybe some videos somewhere or other web sites. This is the only good site about locating I have found so far. Thanks

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    Default Re: Phone peds

    Quote Originally Posted by Mke View Post
    How Dare you sir!

    Most of my locates are done with the 810 @ 83.1... I will admit that it isn't for the faint of heart. However, I will take the Analog response of the 810 over the digital readouts on all other machines.
    Dang, I miss my Metrotech 810 alot.

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    Default Re: Phone peds

    Here's my 2 cents on the subject. If locating out of a ped that is very close to a metal fence you need to do this... UNBOND EVERYTHING in the ped first. Nothing should be grounded. Place your transmitter as far from the fence as you can. Now place your ground even farther from the fence. You probably have an idea where the drop to the home runs so don't put your ground near that either. When inserting your ground you want to insert it just a couple of inches into the ground. You don't want full power. You want your signal as weak as possible while still getting a locatable signal. You may need to push your ground rod in deeper if you aren't getting a good locate.

    1. Everything unbonded
    2. ground is as far from everything as possible. Everything being the fence, ped, and line you are locating.
    3. ground rod barely inserted into ground. This is assuming your dirt is moist and conductive.
    4. adjust ground rod as needed. If fence is still a problem, pull the ground rod out. Ive laid my ground rod on the ground before and placed a rock on top of it so it is making contact with the ground but not inserted.
    5. take your time and experiment if needed.

    Your main goal is to keep your signal weak so it doesn't get sucked up by the fence.
    "Change does not always equal progress."

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    Default Re: Phone peds

    I had one instance that makes me scratch my head constantly. I was a newb.. barely a week on my own and I got called out to a locate where my training supervisor had missed a telephone cable coming out of an old rickety ped. The excavator had nicked it and I was assigned the job of marking out all 15 lines that were running out of this pedestal.

    So I disconnect every line inside the ped and proceeded to direct connect each one individually like I was taught. Through trial and repetition I managed to find each line except for 1. Re-position the transmitter multiple times, re-position the ground multiple times.. still nothing on this last line. Finally, out of sheer lack of options I connected everything back up inside the ped and direct connect to it. Clear as day the pesky line that I fought for over 1.5 hours to find lights up. We daylight it and it's right on target. This was using a 3M machine.

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    Default Re: Phone peds

    Try your ring clamp sometimes it will work better than direct connect around fences
    yahoo likes this.

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