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Thread: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

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    Default From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    A hot top is overtime. It is a part of this business that we locators get hot about and complain to our management. The thing I can assure you of is that management would just as soon not have locators work over 40 hours a week. Overtime reduces or eliminates profit and that is not the goal of these companies.

    Many of our areas the work is almost as seasonal as a farmer's. Usually work load in Winter drops significantly and when Spring, Summer and Fall come along we get buried with work. We can often work 60 or more hours a week. The answer of hiring so many locators that we do not work OT in the busy seasons is a double edged sword, we now have too many locators in the slow time. So many that the profits of the busy time are lost. The only answer then is to fire off the now extra locators. That is less desirable then working a lot of OT for most people. True some firms layoff during slow season and firms that do this too much cannot maintain an adequate workforce for when the busy season returns. These firms become unstable. So heavy OT is part of the industry. Complaining about it is a waste of time as there is nothing that can be done.

    Federal law and regulations do not limit how many hours we can be required to work in a week, only that we get paid time and a half for all hours over 40. Some states may have regulation of their own that are different. So yes, we can be required to work OT and if we refuse we can be fired for refusing to perform our jobs.

    One complaint I often hear is "I have to do this or I have to do that" and that whatever they have to do is so important that they should not be required to stay while the other locators have to work mandatory OT.

    My answer has been that while you feel time with your family (relative in town, kids, spouse, whatever) is more important the locator what wants off for bowling league, pets { I had one locator who insisted they had to be home to feed their dog at 5:30 every night} and whatever feel those things are just as important to them. The supervisor will not allow themselves to be placed in the position of allowing people off for one thing and denying another thing as a matter of daily routine. Doing this places the company in the position where they would have to allow anyone who wanted off to get off.

    There is another part of OT I need to explain, OT and raises.

    This is one most of us have not heard of or thought of.

    A locator has a sit down with the Manager and demands a raise. Says they cannot feed their children on what they are being paid. The manager looks them straight in the eye and says do not give them that b***s****. Tells them that they turned down almost all of the offered overtime and begged out of oncall by getting other locators to work it in their place.
    If their kids were really hungry they would have worked OT to get the money to feed their children. So their kids were eating just fine and they did not need more money to feed their children or anything else. They turned down thousands of dollars of OT which must mean the regular 40 hour paycheck was all they needed.

    That is the honest to God truth and has been repeated in some unknown number of meetings in offices across our industry.

    When general raise time comes around the manager usually has a bulk amount of money to distribute as raises to their locators. A locator who worked a lot of OT and have all around good performance tend to get better raises. They appear to need the need the OT money and when the company needs people to work OT those people are their. So it is worth paying them a higher percentage of the pool of OT money to entice them to stay working there. The ones that don't work OT are just not as desirable to keep.
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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Locators side I am the hightest production person on my crew by far my damage rate is around 1-8000 no high profiles in almost 15 years. I don't have company insurance I am the first to take RIF in the slow season I work 60 hrs + during the busy season and all I ask is 1 week off to go on a family vacation that we have gone on for 50 some years. I took a 3 dollar cut to work for my current employer . In return I have been told that no raises for the last 3 years.

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Quote Originally Posted by orangeboots View Post
    Locators side I am the hightest production person on my crew by far my damage rate is around 1-8000 no high profiles in almost 15 years. I don't have company insurance I am the first to take RIF in the slow season I work 60 hrs + during the busy season and all I ask is 1 week off to go on a family vacation that we have gone on for 50 some years. I took a 3 dollar cut to work for my current employer . In return I have been told that no raises for the last 3 years.
    Yes, but what are you trying to say? You have laid out some facts but make no statements or asked any questions.

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Just trying to give a different point of view. You are stating the view from the supes standoint I am giving 1 locators point. Ifyou had a locator with these nunbers would you go to bat for better pay?

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Sorry don't drink and type without spellcheck

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    I think the pro locator just opened a great big can of worms!!!! This should be good!!!!

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    I work as much OT as the company will let me and I even do oncall for ppl who cry about it such as weekends and what not and still get shitty raises and questioned when I want to take a scheduled day off. So, dont feed me a line of crap kid.
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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Quote Originally Posted by orangeboots View Post
    Just trying to give a different point of view. You are stating the view from the supes standoint I am giving 1 locators point. Ifyou had a locator with these nunbers would you go to bat for better pay?
    Yes I would support a raise. But remember, the supervisor does not actually give raises, that is the area manager above the supervisor. Also the area manager gets authorization for raises from a district manager / regional VP or someone in corporate. It is outside your offices where raises come from.

    Pay raise is in itself another topic. The topic of this thread is overtime and overtime work or refusal to work OT can affect a raise but it is only part of the raise process. Things like attendance, which is another thread I intend to submit, also affects a raise.

    Save your raise questions for a raise thread as there are factors outside of overtime involved in a raise. I have several points on this but they are off topic for this tread and will only make the thread confusing.

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Quote Originally Posted by union_YES View Post
    I work as much OT as the company will let me and I even do oncall for ppl who cry about it such as weekends and what not and still get shitty raises and questioned when I want to take a scheduled day off. So, dont feed me a line of crap kid.
    Not a line of 'crap', just the facts of our industry.

    If your office / company is properly run or not is separate and specific to your office / company, this thread is about OT and our industry.

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Quote Originally Posted by ProfessionalLocator View Post

    This is one most of us have not heard of or thought of.

    A locator has a sit down with the Manager and demands a raise. Says they cannot feed their children on what they are being paid. The manager looks them straight in the eye and says do not give them that b***s****. Tells them that they turned down almost all of the offered overtime and begged out of oncall by getting other locators to work it in their place.
    If their kids were really hungry they would have worked OT to get the money to feed their children. So their kids were eating just fine and they did not need more money to feed their children or anything else. They turned down thousands of dollars of OT which must mean the regular 40 hour paycheck was all they needed.

    That is the honest to God truth and has been repeated in some unknown number of meetings in offices across our industry.
    That sounds eerily similar to a few of my comments. Yes, you MUST work the OT as needed if you're going to be a valuable employee but, the thing is, what happens when you worked all the overtime, did the on-calls, helped outside your area, and you realize your pay rate will just barely cover the bills in the summer, let alone saving money back to get through the lean winter months? Your example doesn't accurately reflect the mindset of a lot of this industry. Most new locators don't realize that 10 - 12 bucks an hour just won't get you through the lean months whether you work all the summer OT or not. By the time they start demanding raises, they can be replaced by another newb and the cycle repeats.

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Quote Originally Posted by daman1 View Post
    That sounds eerily similar to a few of my comments. Yes, you MUST work the OT as needed if you're going to be a valuable employee but, the thing is, what happens when you worked all the overtime, did the on-calls, helped outside your area, and you realize your pay rate will just barely cover the bills in the summer, let alone saving money back to get through the lean winter months? Your example doesn't accurately reflect the mindset of a lot of this industry. Most new locators don't realize that 10 - 12 bucks an hour just won't get you through the lean months whether you work all the summer OT or not. By the time they start demanding raises, they can be replaced by another newb and the cycle repeats.
    A different subject than this thread. The problem of pay rates being adequate is an industry wide problem. This thread focuses on OT, why the company must require it, and the effects upon us for working or not working OT.

    I find many locators are 'pocket rich' and a separate thread, not one of the Supervisor's Notebook, could address this. There are some tricks to use to save money up for Winter.

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Hey Pro, your right about alot of locators complaining about overtime. I have heard the cases you are talking about with managers saying you turned down overtime to be off for the weekends or home early ( before 17:00 which to me is not leaving early) on the weeknights. If your working from 7-5 then to me that is a full day's worth of work. The thing you and upper management don't understand or care about is that some of us have a life outside the industry of locating, ( ie, kids that need a dad or mom home in time to see them or take them to games and be a parent). And so what if a guy needs to go home to feed his dog, If the company want's to give out a 2% raise once every 2-3 years, that's fine, but don't expect to get a huge life dedication in return.
    For the one's that you say get better raises for working all the OT and not complaing, your right!! But those guy's are usally new to the game and still gung-ho about getting a great job versus the Burger King they came from. I aggree with Union-Yes, your just a full fledged company man feeding a line of crap.
    union_YES and Enjoythefall like this.

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    paying out OT is far cheaper in the long run than adding more employees to your payroll ! no matter which locating company I have worked for they NEVER discouraged me from working OT . OT is a must ....and when it is cut out....it will be a disaster!
    wise men talk because they have something to say and fools because they have to say something....plato

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    I aggre with ya yahoo, but how much OT is too much? My company expects you to work sun-up to sun-down plus a full day on weekends all through the dig season. Sorry, but that's just not going to happen!!!!

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    Default Re: From Supervisor's Notebook - Overtime

    Quote Originally Posted by superman View Post
    Hey Pro, your right about alot of locators complaining about overtime. I have heard the cases you are talking about with managers saying you turned down overtime to be off for the weekends or home early ( before 17:00 which to me is not leaving early) on the weeknights. If your working from 7-5 then to me that is a full day's worth of work. The thing you and upper management don't understand or care about is that some of us have a life outside the industry of locating, ( ie, kids that need a dad or mom home in time to see them or take them to games and be a parent). And so what if a guy needs to go home to feed his dog, If the company want's to give out a 2% raise once every 2-3 years, that's fine, but don't expect to get a huge life dedication in return.
    For the one's that you say get better raises for working all the OT and not complaing, your right!! But those guy's are usally new to the game and still gung-ho about getting a great job versus the Burger King they came from. I aggree with Union-Yes, your just a full fledged company man feeding a line of crap.
    You can wrongly believe I am a "company man" all you like. If what I write sounds like the 'company line' that is incidental and it is defiantly not a "line of crap". What I write applies to all business and especially us since we are all employees.

    Yes we all have a life outside of work and if the job interferes with that too much we quit and get a job that does not interfere, we move on.

    Our employers have their version of the last sentence. If we are not available for OT to the extent we interfere with their ability to make their profit they get rid of us (quit us) and move on without us.

    For you noobies, and some of the more experienced, reading this thread there is a reaction among some of us on the level of a petulant teenager. We often hear 'that's bogus', 'that's bullshit' and so on to real world situations that are dictated by outside forces we have no control over. It mattesr not if we think these situations are just or not, they are as they are and we deal with then realistically, not idealistically, or they overwhelm us.

    Anybody here think I work 60 and more hours a week without OT pay because I am a 'company man'? I work the hours without OT as a supervisor as when I was a locator getting paid OT: I have been unable to find better. So until we find better we have to be adult and bare the unbearable.

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